“Dad, may I join the 8th Scouts”. That was February 1931. At first, I did not take kindly to this thought as I did not know much about the movement, but after a very pleasant talk to the Scoutmaster - Bob Miller (an ideal man for all boys) my son Tom was admitted to the Troop. Meetings were held at the small Church Hall and on one of my visits I found that the Troop was a few pounds in debt to the Church which I thought was very bad. Now I know that Bob Miller and his wife were hard workers, they were always having some members up to their own house in Shepherds Lane, but money was scarce and hard to get so I thought that I would take a hand and see what I could do.
I knew the Treasurer by name only, a Mr Moorling who attended the Parish Church as did my wife and self. I advertised a dance at the Church Hall about 1934 and it was well attended. Nearly 200 persons paid for admission and as the time advanced I had to turn away a number of undesirables as I knew that they would cause trouble. As a result of the dance I was able to hand over to the Treasurer the sum of £5. lOs.Od.
The success of running a dance urged me on so others were put on with plenty of help from my wife and other ladies in the kitchen. The dances were a financial success and the money was passed on and the troop was able to get out of debt to the Church Authorities of which I was pleased. It was asking too much of a scout troop to charge them 6/- per night.
February 1939 Mr Moorling died and I took over the Treasurership with the total funds of the Troop at £1.17s.6d. I now felt it was up to me to if possible increase the funds. I started monthly “Whist Drives” at the small Church Hall and was well supported. It was wonderful what the public would do if you told them what you wanted and what the cause is you are working for. I had cinema tickets given for first prizes, towels, brushes etc. and even a permanent hair wave for a lady winner if she wished. It all helped to swell the funds in saving me buying prizes. In 1936-37 a profit of £20.10s.6d and so they continued until the war broke out.
The war took the Church Hall away from the Troop so I continued the ccWhist Drives” at my residence then 25 Beech Road, Dartford. People supported me well and on one occasion I had 54 players and to make room I had to take the bed down in my bedroom to make it possible for them to play. But what work for my dear wife afterwards; the mess was awful with cigarette ends stamped out in the carpets etc. but I thought that is was worth it if I was to get enough money to get a Headquarters of our own. One could only charge 7d per person and as refreshments were provided the profit was not great but it all helped to the extent of £6.12s.0d and the Hall profit was £13.12s.2d. Money was hard to get and it was much smaller than today as wages were lower.
Another venture for money I had an H.M. V. radiogram and would hire it out at 3/6 per evening. It was not much to charge but if one asked higher it would not have caught on. A dancing mistress used to have it in her lessons at the small Church Hall and my elder son Tom used to take it in my car when I could not manage it. It was rather awkward for we had to take one of the front seats out and wangle it in the best we could and people were not helpful in getting it out and in. In all it made about £3.10s.0d but the funds kept growing which was encouraging.
The original Rover Crew were very good in running socials and sales of work. Chief Leaders were Frank Williams and Kath Wells (now his wife); also Bob King and Ella Stapley (now his wife); they with others collected and made things for sale and it was more than a help of course. There were George Usher, Tom Hall, Charles Stapley, Richardson and those whose names I cannot remember.
As the years advanced waste paper collected was the order of things and the Scouts and Cubs with their pickup cart would go round the estate on Saturday mornings getting as much as the cart would hold. They would collect and bring it to my garage at 25 Beech Road where I would sort it all out into bundles and after tying each one to make it weigh 281bs. This went on for weeks and believe me it was not an easy job for about two and a half tons was collected. I had to stack it up each side of my garage and there was hardly any room for my own car. I communicated with a London firm of waste paper dealers and it was a great day when the van arrived to take away the first ton. That constituted 80 bundles of 281bs each. Ever tried to throw up 80 bundles on your own? - just try it - we were pleased with the money about £7.15s.Od.
Another stunt for money. Sale of Scout calendar cards. I went to London and purchased a few thousand to see how they would go. They went well; I spent the sum of £126.14s.6. and thanks to Don Bevan and his father Mr Bevan (senior) the venture was a great success. The boys worked well and were kept at it and as a result we made a profit of about £179.0s.0d. This cheered me up but I must stress that Don worked hard and always did. It was a lot of money to check in and Mr Bevan’s son was always very helpful.
Whilst we were at the garage in Oakfield Lane with the help of another man on this estate we all made various toys as at that time there were very few in the shops. I was able to get a certain amount and a firm at Thames Road kindly gave me off cuts and plywood and we determined to see what we could do. We made motor trucks, fire engines, small toys and wooden horses and a profit of about £30.0s.0d was made. Mr Exeter of Queen Street, Dartford knew that I required wood so as he had a goof buy at a brewery of wooden crates he sent us a lorry load free which was very generous.
At that time firewood was scarce and we were able to easily sell that which we did not require and made the sum of £14.0s.0d. We lost a certain amount of wood through it being stolen.Tomatoes were another venture. I bought a few plants which were grown near the hut garage and we made a profit of 13/-.
As a result of the money we had in the bank I thought that the Troop should have a marquee and other tentage so on 12th May 1938 I, in the company of my wife and a friend, motored down to Rye, near Hastings, to a tent maker and after a while I settled on a marquee for £21.15s.Od; a small bell tent (square) £7.7s.6d and latrines £5.5s.6d. The marquee has been a great blessing. It was pitched for the first time at Sir Stephen Tallents, St Johns, Sutton-at-Hone Jamboree in 1938. It has been taken to all summer camps and as Cowes, Isle of Wight; it was most invaluable as the weather was awful but it did its job well. It has been hired out to various persons and the returns to 1959 have been £88.0s0d which means it has paid for itself four times over.
In September 1952 I was approached by the Kent Education Committee to be allowed the use of the hall for a class of children from Oakfield Lane School as they needed extra accommodation. I agreed to this after I had counselled with Mrs Bevan, who at that time was the caretaker. The children moved in and I had our first payment in December. Altogether they occupied the hall for fifteen months and we collected the sum of £125.0s.0d. I would like to say how well Mrs Bevan worked with the teachers; she was very friendly and kept the hall lovely and clean and after the termination of their occupation I think that she missed her little duties but the money was still useful.
It was not our intention to get the habit of letting the hall but I like to be reasonable and in 1957 I was asked if a band of ladies could hire it for about twelve afternoons for needlework lessons. To this I agreed for I think that it is only right to help those who go out to help others especially if they have to pay their own way, so up to date - November 1959 - we have received the sum of £11.12s.6d. Money is not everything but it all helps if you have an object in view and I certainly have for I want to be able to buy the land on which our hut stands.
The war of 1939 came and as a result the small Church Hall was taken away for the use of the Scouts as it was required for other purposes - post office etc. Where are they to go? Bob King was the Scoutmaster and meetings somewhere were arranged by him but I wanted somewhere so that they could call it their own.
I had in view premises in Lowfield Street over the Bank but that was taken by the Women’s Voluntary Service so I called on Mr Waterman, House Agent (now deceased) and had a talk to him as I knew that he was agent for a wide area. I searched about and saw that there was a disused double garage in Oakfield Lane near Cedar Road. It was in an awful condition both double doors almost in pieces, slated off the roof, no plaster on the walls, windows out and the large inspection in the floor half full of water but I felt something could be made out of it if we were allowed to use it. So I again saw Mr Waterman and he gladly gave me permission to use it. I think that it was the property of Mrs Temple Johnson.
I visited the property and marked out what I should do. I first got the Scouts to come in and clean all the filth and cobwebs down, then I set them the task of chipping the inside walls and raking out the mortar joints so that new plaster would hold. I had a friend to help me mend the two front doors and another to put the glass in the windows. Another friend took off the damaged slates and put on new - not an easy job. A lot of earth had to be moved so that the doors could be opened properly and the banks has to be tidied up to allow us to get in and then locks and bolts to be put on. I had a load of ballast and cement brought in at cost price and then my hard work began. I had to fill in the inspection pit with all the rubble I could find and it took quite a lot of material and time. After this I had to prepare the ground for paths and then concrete them. The walls then were a problem as they looked awful after they had been prepared for the plasterer. Now, to get the place plastered out and the floor cemented would have cost a lot of money but I had an acquaintance who was a Ware Time Police Reserve and on talking to him about the Scout garage he volunteered to do the work for me just to help the Troop along so I ordered all the materials and I assisted at times by acting as labourer. Sometimes the work was carried on until past midnight. At this stage I feel more than grateful for all he did of his own free will
The next thing was to think about lighting by electricity as when I took over the garage there was none but Mr Exeter of Queen Street, Dartford gave me six ship’s lanterns which he had bought at Chatham Dockyard in a sale. They were all brass and after a lot of cleaning looked quite nice on the walls and gave forth reasonable soft light. I bought electric cable and another friend of mine (a Policeman) wired the hall out and after the power was put on we were all very happy.
As the floor was concrete one had to think of injury to the boys so I communicated with Mr Langan of the London Paper Mills and he sent me two wet felts from off the paper machinery and we were comfortable with the floor covered. As we then had no chairs or seating I made lockers all round the walls and we were once more out of our difficulties. All our equipment had to be stored above our heads on the beams.
The next thing was to think about heating so I had to get a small Tortoise?? stove. Another friend took some slated off the roof for the smoke pipe and he installed the stove and heat was on - what a nice feeling when the Troop first used it.
The wall of the garden at the rear was broken down and served as a short cut for lazy people so I had to rebuild it and put broken glass on the top to keep back those who objected to it, and they did. Next the front six foot fence had to be repaired. It took quite a time as wood was scarce I had to take a piece of the fence lower down where it did not matter and make do and mend and also repair the two large gated and it was quite a relief when it was done. About 1943, the Dartford Borough Council allowed the large house which was next to the garage standing in a large section of ground in Oakfield Lane to be taken over as a Community Centre and as in nearly all new projects it went well for a time and numbers were large. Their Committee soon decided that the Scouts had got to pay for their garage and asked us to be affiliated to them at a fee of £5.5s.Od per year. After a time they stated that all members of the Troop were using the Community Centre had to pay an additional fee.
All went well for a time, we paid four year’s subscription in all but after I had paid the third the fright came. I was ill in bed with fibrocitis and I was informed that the Committee of the Community Centre had decided that they wanted the use of our headquarters for themselves as they wished to run a juvenile class for something. I immediately wrote to A.F. Taylor Esq., East Hill and another to ask if they would visit me to talk over this news. Mr Taylor very kindly came and reassured me he would do something if only delay the move until I could get about.
When I recovered I was invited before the Community Centre Committee to state the case for the Scouts and I must say they were very patient and understanding with the result that we stayed in our headquarters and paid our fees as required. But I knew that it would not rest like that so I searched about for land on which we could build, as we had by this time a fair sum of money. I visited and inspected a plot of land opposite Osterberg College in Oakfield Lane but found that there was a condition on the use of the land and that condition bared us. I next visited two plots near Carsington Gardens but they were both scheduled for dwelling houses. I next went to the bungalow in Lowfield Street which stands in a large piece of ground. I saw the owner but he did not wish to sell any plot. Next I wrote to Harrison and Barber and respecting the “Horse Slaughter House” in Norman Road. They sent one of their men down to talk to me but the sum asked was £l,OOO.Os.Od which included a cottage but this was too much for us so I looked round the estate and then saw the Housing Superintendent with the result I focused my attention on the Community Ground.
One day in 1947 my son Harry, then Lieutenant Harry Hilton, H.M. Navy was home for a few days. About 1 Oth April we walked through the Communal Ground to the bottom and although the last 100 feet frontage was covered with bushes about 5 feet high I though that it would be a very pleasant and suitable plot. On one side Laburnum trees were in bloom and tall trees near the boundary fence; it was an attractive position so I sent a letter to H.Kerr (Borough Surveyor) asking permission to use the land and had a reply on the 11th instant asking for a rough sketch of hut etc. and he advised me to contact Mr Hicks (Building Inspector). This was indeed good news. I lost no time in seeing Mr Hicks and he and another person were very helpful. He contacted one of his male staff and plans were made out to their advice and knowledge and as a result of another letter to Mr Kerr I received permission to go ahead on the 25th August 1947. The site was in an awful state so we had cut down all overgrown bushes and trees and think of digging for foundations which on account of top soil had to be deeper than I wanted.
As this time there was a war-time camp of prisoners of war for German soldiers etc at Swanscombe and Wilmington and as Harry asked me if I would mind him bringing three home if he could get permission from the Captain of the camp. This I did and as a result I asked them if they would like to do work at our proposed Scout Headquarters.
I knew for some time that there were four army huts on the Fleet Estate which had been occupied by Canadian soldiers as a gun site and as they were being sold I ascertained that a Mr Franklin (Senior), builders, had bought them and that they were at Erith. He was the proprietor of the hotel next to the G.P.O. I visited him - at first he was not anxious to sell but after three visits he agreed to let me purchase one for the Scouts at the high price of £280.0s.0d. This was on 6th October 1947. Now that the hut was purchased I had to have the ground staked out at correct measurements for foundations. This Mr Ward (Senior), foreman at Millers agreed to , free of charge, so now I asked the three prisoners of war to get busy and dig for the concrete to be put in trenches that they prepared - four outside and two centre lengths. I had ordered bricks from Sankeys but before they could be delivered an outside concrete 18” thick wall adjoining the pavement had to be broken down and it was very hard work. The steel chisels had to be resharpened, also two sections of the oak fence had to be removed. This was not easy as it was on top of the bank. The Dartford Borough Council sanctioned the work on the 24th September 1947 to make steps.
The bricks arrived after the wall was broken down and it was quite a job carrying all the foundation bricks up the bank (which was about six feet high) from the pavement but there was plenty of room and the boys worked hard.
In the meantime I had ordered the hut to be delivered and duly on the Saturday, after the bank was cut back, my son Peter, myself and the three Germans were on the ground awaiting the arrival of our past endeavours. Two lorries arrived about 3.00 p.m. full up with the sections. They were very heavy to lift but we managed to back the lorries close up to the bank and the tail boards made a kind of landing stage. We all set to and gently we managed to stack all on our ground but what a help the Germans were, one of them in particular. He was a man about six feet tall and very broad and big. Each time he took a whole section on his back and walked on uneven ground, put the section in place and just laughed. At last they were all unloaded but on close examination I discovered that several sections were broken and needed a lot of repairing. This is where my carpenter son, Peter, was such a great help. He fixed various pieces in the places but of course at this time all building materials were rationed and timber was very scarce. But I had friends who had more timber than they required on their licences so we had the benefit of their gifts and Peter was kept busy repairing side and roof before we could start to assemble. All the floor boards were thick with lime etc so I had to get the German to mix concrete on them to get them clean. Thank to the. Refil petrol station next door we had plenty of water.
The following Saturday after the foundations were finished we began to assemble. What a joy to see it gradually take shape but it was not very easy. Fresh bolt holes had to be made etc and the fixing of the roof was quite a job as the hut had been roughly treated when being dismantled, but after a lot of patience and help all was in order but not watertight. So, I had to get Harry Goodman (plumber) to completely recover all with good quality and we all helped but it was not easy with out limited use of ladders but at last it was done. It was just a bare hut inside - no lining to roof or sides so once more I had to see one of our travellers and the following week the compressed board was delivered. To line the inside of the roof I used to meet a Mr Collyer (Peter’s father-in-law) at 5.30 p.m. after he came from his work at the outfall works. He was a good worker at anything. It was an awkward job but after a week it was finished and later the sides of the hall were covered. But the sides did not last long as the boys broke them while playing about so I had to purchase sheet iron, put it all round the hall and board over this to match the top. This was quite a success.
Now for lighting. Leslie Brown, one of the old members of the 8th, offered to wire the hut out free of charge if I would get the wire etc. This I did and it saved us pounds.
Next I had bought a large Tortoise coke stove for heating and it stood out from the wall and took up part of the hall so Mr Rose offered to allow his men to make a brick recess if I would cut the side of the hut to allow it to stand partly outside in the made recess. This was a wonderful gesture on his part for it entailed scaffolding being erected, supplying bricks, chimney pot, plastering out and all the time of his men. This was a wonderful gift which must have cost him a few pounds of which we were truly grateful.
Now for lavatories. Bill Richardson, an old member verified the ground work with me and then drew up plans for two lavatories (boys and girls) and a small washing up sink etc. The plans were submitted to Dartford Borough Council and I had sanction on 11th May 1948. This work I asked Mr Rose to do as I felt it was best as we were not fitted to break into and connect up sources. All this was done at £150.0s.0d - a good job as it covered all plumbing and electric lighting, water etc. I must mention the making of the steps as I thought Mr Colyer made a very good job of them as I have mentioned previously. He used to do the work after he left the sewerage works at 5.00 p.m. To start these steps two iron rails had to be sunk at the sides to stop the bank falling and it was quite a job making each step in turn, for the soil was very loose and kept falling but I helped him as much as I could and as each step was made carberundum??? powder was put on to stop slipping in wet weather. Also long grooves were made with some object. Together with the side walls and pillars at the top and bottom finished off the job and all was completed by November. He was a good thorough workman and only charged 2/6 per hour.
The Anderson shelter I bought from Ashen Drive for £1.0s.0d and as I had the opportunity I collected them with the driver of my employer, another kind help
Next the path from the top of the steps to the hall was laid out by my old friend Albert Joyce. Then with other help all old bricks etc were collected and removed down, concrete was made step formed and that was another job finished.
Once again another snag. The hall used to get very hot when large numbers were present. So, as Mr Miller (my employer) had a few tall metal ventilators discarded from the Southern Hospital, I paid him £2.0s.0d for the two he let me have. Harry Goodman cut the apex of the roof and fitted the ventilators on for £1 .Os.Od. It made a nice difference and as they turned in the wind it circulated air inside the hall.
After various painting of the inside of the hall, purchase of chairs, tables etc we were approaching the thought of the “official opening” of the hall. This we had the pleasure of on Saturday 31st January 1948 at 7.30 p.m. It certainly was a lovely evening. Mr Mayland (Commissioner), Canon Mitchell etc and not least of all St Stephen Tailant who kindly officially declared open all our efforts. A very rewarding evening to all who had contributed in one way or another.
As time went on it was obvious that we required more room for all equipment, tentage etc. So it was decided to build a brick extension - what an undertaking. I applied to the Dartford Borough Council on 18th November 1950 and this was granted on 29th January 1951. But before we could start, the ground had to be cleared of all scrub, small trees etc. Also a big item had to be overcome; a manhole three feet deep was at the rear of the hall and that had to be dug out and the drain at the bottom replaced with earthenware pipe. This in turn had to be covered with six inches of good concrete. It was quite hard work cutting the old pipe out and replacing with new. As this drain was connected with the Summerhill House at the top of the ground and had to be completed in accordance with instructions of the Dartford Borough Council’s building inspectors.
The foundation had to be marked out so Mr Ward (foreman of Millers) offered to come and stamp and set it out for me of which I was glad. We started to dig but had to keep the soil from the foundations as we had to bring up the floor of the extension as near to the level of the hall as possible.
I ordered 15,000 bricks from Sankeys and the first 7,500 were delivered on a Saturday at 8.00 a.m. in two lorries but as there was no help available they had to be stacked up on the bank and pavement. At 2.00 p.m. several boys arrived and all the bricks were carted on the trick// cart up the steps to the other end of the ground. They worked well and another 7,500 bricks were delivered the following Saturday. This time I got the drivers to stack all on the steps which made it easier for us to remove and all went well.
“Croe” Chapman, Mr Joyce, Don Bevan, myself and others continued to prepare concrete for foundations and the laying of bricks started. Mr B Stacey (bricklayer’s friend) kept us shipshape and corrected all faults at 3/- per hour (well worth it). I had allowed for all walls to be two bricks thick as we were all novices and I thought that it was safest. As the foundation grew upwards I had to think of scaffolding so I approached Mr Meilis who very kindly lent us all the steel scaffolding, planks, barrows, fittings etc. free of charge. People are very generous. As the building grew I had to see about windows. Mr Bremner kindly gave us two iron framed ones for the Seniors room; the others came at cost price.
Now for the lintels over the windows and doors. As there was quite a heap of old iron at the end of the ground I was able to take what was suitable and inserted them in the concrete in the boxes I had made. This I could do after I had left the office at 5.00 p.m. and after about three days they were lifted into their respective places by our willing helpers - Croe Chapman, Albert Joyce etc. So far so good but when we were joist high I had to think of timbers and once again we had luck as there was surplus in Miller’s yard and we were made a present of this. I had the oak beams etc at home so I inserted them in the ceiling of the Senior room. Again all rafters and perlings came through Mr Wilson who had more than he required on timber licence.
Mr Porter did quite a bit of plastering, putting plasterboards in passage ceiling and making it out all free work. Of course the usual willing workers were always doing their share and Bill Stacey kept his eye on the vital spots and kept walls straight. Albert Joyce was always guiding someone to do the right thing as we were all novices. My chief occupation was mixing mortar to keep the workers going for as long as there was mortar prepared they laid more bricks. Now the question of roofing as I had an acquaintance in Powder Mill Lane who supplied at cost and gave us £1.0s.0d. towards expenses and delivered same. Harry Goodman fixed all after he had finished work and only charged 3/- per hour. Don Bevan (Scoutmaster) was a great help and a blessing as he was able to keep the younger boys doing something to help. During all the work we had quite a lot of rain so under the circumstances the boys worked well. Pip?? Pither?? was another good worker, Croe Chapman made the door frames and I purchased four second-hand doors cheaply from Hawley Road.
During the building, all ballast, sand, and cement had to be carried up the steps which was not easy. Under the strain the axle of the trek-cart broke and had to be repaired. Altogether eight and a half tons of cement, twenty five yards of ballast, and twelve yards of sand had to be carried up. Quite a lot of work for all and not easy work, but we managed it and came away many times quite tired but felt it was worth it.
After the hall was completed we had to think of tidying up and making the paths which was quite a job. Our old friend Albert Joyce re-built a manhole cover on the left hand side of the hall. He also built most of the low wall with a little help from Croe Chapman. Concreting all round the hall took quite a few weekends as all the soil had to be dug out, levels made to be in line with foundations of the hall. Now all seemed to be finished and when all was cleared up we were pleased.
At about 1.30 a.m. on the night of 19th February 1954 I was informed by Dartford Police that the 8th Dartford Scout Hall was on fire and the Dartford Fire Brigade was in attendance. What a shock at that time of night. I went at once to the Hall and was quite relieved to find that the fire had occurred in what is the Scoutmaster’s Room. At that time it was fully stacked with sceneiy that Don Laker had made for a two night show he and others were putting on to raise more money. I found that the scenery was destroyed and all else in the room - the ceiling and joists - had gone as also had the roof. The fire had started in the timbers in the Hall but it would appear that owing to the room being two bricks thick that it confined the fire to that room so that it proved our efforts to build well had been rewarded.
The discovery of the fire was detected by Mr and Mrs Elcome of Myrtle Road who had just returned home and saw the reflection of the flames as they entered their living room. Mr Elcome kindly called the Fire Brigade and had it not have been for his kindness there is no doubt that all our Head Quarters would have been lost. I called at 11 Myrtle Road and expressed to them our appreciation and at a later date expressed our thanks by presenting Mrs Elcome with a large box of chocolates and Mr Elcome with cigarettes. They expressed their pleasure to accept and to think that they were able to call the Fire Brigade.
On 19th February, I reported this loss to the Prudential Insurance Company and they in turn asked me to communicate with Messrs. Robertson, Corly and Company, which I did. It was arranged that I should meet their representative and what a pleasant surprise when I met him to discover that he was a Scoutmaster from a London group. The feeling was mutual and he made things much easier with the result that I received a cheque for £88.1Os.Od. for the Hall and £62.12s.Od for loss of equipment.
I had previously obtained an estimate from J Miller and Son of £82.1 Os.Od. for repairs and these were carried out promptly. It would appear that when the fire started someone had entered the seat of the fire as the window was found wide open so I decided to have iron bars inserted in the inside brickwork to prevent anyone entering by that way, at an extra £14.18s.0d.
It was fortunate that the floors had only been concrete screeded so no damage had been done. I took the opportunity of having them coated with mastic for £23.13s.Od by. asphalters from Foots Cray.
About 30th November 1959 I accidentally met Mr T Armstrong in Chastilian Road and mentioning the matter of our Headquarters he replied that the Council were considering the surrender of the lease of Summerhill Community ground. After further talk he invited me to meet him in his office at Dartford Borough Council. This I did on Monday 8th December 1959. I was anxious that we could save our Headquarters and also obtain a lease on the ground. He was most helpful and did everything possible to help me. He mentioned the Sunday School as the Community Centre and asked if we would be prepared to accommodate them if a lease for us on the ground was obtainable. An annual ground rent of £25.Os.Od was agreed so then he spoke to Mr Hewett ofChampion and Waterman (agent for the ground) by telephone asking if he would use his good offices for us. I then went to see Mr Hewett and agreed to the rent and Sunday School classes. He in turn wrote to the Solicitors - Messrs. Foyer, White and Prescott of 55 Park Lane, London stating our case but I had to visit Mr D N Stubbs of Messrs. Bailey and Goff (Solicitors) of 55 Spital Street and repeat my previous quotations with the result he in turn took up with London the possibility on a lease on the ground as this property is held in trust by Trustees of the last Temple Johnson. Mrs Rosamund Hope Wright of Hawley Manor, Hawley (next of kin) had to give her permission. After a time a lease was granted to the 8th Dartford Scout Group for a period of five years from 25th December 1960 to 25th December 1965 at an annual rent of £25.0s.0d. for a frontage of fifty feet. We originally held about eighty feet; it was quite a pleasant spot surrounded by lilac and other trees but I was quite happy to hold fifty feet which was quite a nice size. It was very generous of Mr Stubbs to conduct all this work free of all professional fees except stamp duty and something I greatly appreciated. This lease called for three Trustees for the 8th Dartford and were duly recorded as G H Hilton of 67 Heather Drive, Dartford, Charles Stapley of 29 Wilmington Court Road, Wilmington and Albert Joyce of 20 Sycamore Road, Dartford.
Going back to my first knowledge of the Council wishing to give up the lease, I visited the Community Centre where the Sunday School classes were being held and saw Mr R Melling. He had no knowledge of this and was quite worried as he had about ninety children. He and others were giving up their time every Sunday to teach and did not want to see their work come to an end so I offered him the use of the Scout Hall for Sunday afternoons which he greatly accepted and offered to pay 7/6 per meeting. So when the Council terminated their agreement the children came to our Headquarters.
This plot of land, less our portion, was then publicly sold to Messrs. Brazier and fetched £15,000 (this is £30 per front footage and at this rate our portion will be £1,500 if we are lucky.
I again visited Mr Hewett with Charles Stapley some time after this sale to ascertain our position and also enquired if the price of the land, if sold to us. could be fixed. But it was pointed out to us that as Mrs Wright travelled abroad quite a lot it would take time.
On 14th September I again visited Mr Hewett and he stated that he had heard from Mrs Wright and that if we bought in the near future the price would be £1,500 but if left for another year the price would be higher.
On 19th September 1963 I had a letter from Mr Hewett confirming our conversation and the price of the land to be £1,500. As.a result I again applied to Mr Roberts of Kent Education Office for the forms to make my application for a money grant of £700 from Kent Education Committee. After I had obtained all particulars from Doug Timms (Scoutmaster) of the numbers of boys using the Hall etc. I added all the items requiring to be answered. After setting out details of Parents Association activities to obtain funds I added a letter to the application form and sent them on. On 8th October 1963 these were returned as it required a letter of support from Mr Talbot (Scout Commissioner). This was obtained and Mr Talbot send all away by return of post and I now await the result. I visited the Trustee Savings Bank and made formal application for withdrawal of money from the Deposit Account at the required three month’s notice.
On 30th December 1963 I again visited Mr Hewett to inform him of progress and my disappointment of not hearing from Kent Education Committee. He then stated that I was not to unduly worry for the land was not up for Public Auction but that as we had got another two years of lease we were the ones who wanted to buy and after a very pleasant talk it was agreed that I should later on contact Kent Education Committee and at the end of March 1964 revisit him to see what could be arranged as at this point we had increased our funds to £968.
On 20th January 1963 I visited Kent Education Office and saw Mr Roberts re my application for a money grant but he informed me that he had heard nothing so whilst there I telephoned Mr Talbot and after a few words I asked Mr Roberts if he would converse with him which he did and it then transpired that Mr Talbot had sent the forms etc to a Mr Owen Simmons who is Secretary or Somebody of account re Pilkington Report. All this resulted in was that Mr Talbot said he would come to 67 Heather Drive and have a talk which he kindly did at 2.45 p.m. on 21st January. He then informed me that as the various applications for grants were so numerous it was possible that my application would not be considered for about two years and then it was a slender chance if I would get a money grant.
We then discussed various avenues we could take and he read correspondence I had had with Head Quarters of Boy Scouts in London and stated that as he was going to London on 23rd instant he would call at Scout Headquarters and see what could be done. As I received no further news from Mr Talbot I wrote to him on the 31st January asking if he would kindly call on me and let me know developments but as he did not I telephoned him on the 7th February. The result was no further news except that as already stated to me the Boy Scouts would advance £300 at 5%. In the meantime I had telephoned Eric Johnson and he stated that if I was not successful with A F Taylor that I was to see him as he felt sure I could borrow the £500 from a source he knew. On the 17th February I again visited A F Taylor and as a result of our conversation he saw his Bank Manager of Martins Bank, Lowfield Street on the 18th instant and at 4.45 p.m. he kindly called at my residence when he informed me that if I saw Mr Hayes(Bank Manager) he felt sure he would be favourable to my request.
On the 19th I called and had a long talk with Mr Hayes?? and he agreed for the bank to loan the 8th Dartford Scouts the sum of £500 towards the purchase of the ground on which our Head Quarters stands providing I could get two signatures?? to his form and that Mr Taylor or someone would stand as guarantors.
I communicated this information to Messrs. C Stapley, Albert Joyce and Woodham (Secretary) and Mr C Stapley called a meeting on 2nd March for the parents to debate the proposed bank loan.
On the 7th March Mr C Stapley kindly called and informed me that the Parents Association had debated the terms of the bank and were pleased and sanctioned taking up the loan of £500 and that the three signatories should be G Hilton, C Stapley and A Joyce.
At 1.30 p.m. on the 10th March C Stapley and I visited Martins Bank and secured from the Assistant Manager a cheque book and paying in book - so far so good. At 10.00 a..m. on the 12th March I called on Mr C Hewett of Messrs. Champion and Waterman, Lowfield Street, Dartford and informed him that the 8th Dartford Scout Group were in a position to purchase the ground for £1,500 and would he set the machine going so as to enable us to secure. He stated that he would communicate with Mr Stubbs, Solicitors of Messrs. Bailey Goff, Spital Street, Dartford within a day and so I would call and acquaint Mr Stubbs of Trustees etc which I did on 13th March 1964. At 10.30 a.m. on the 16th March I called at Trustee Savings Bank and explained to the under Manager about transferring money to Martins Bank and for what purpose and he advised leaving money in Trustee Savings Bank so as to get as much interest at 5% until it is verified. As a result of this I went to Martins Bank and explained to the Manager my anxiety to get as much as interest on our money and he assured me it would be all right and only draw it when the time arrives.At 11.00 a.m. on 17th March I called on Mr D Stubbs, Solicitor and discussed this transaction and he was quite prepared to act for us and would communicate with me when he had advanced and would require more deposit. I also handed to him the lease of our ground and it was agreed that the named three persons would be Trustees of the ground.
I acknowledged letters to Mr Hewett and informed him I would hand 10% of purchase price to Mr Stubbs when notified.
On the 7th Anl A F Taylor called and asked if I had made any progress and advised that I pay the 10% soon in case of other persons having desires for the land. On the 9th April I visited Trustees Savings Bank and drew £150 being 10% of £1,500 and paid into Mr Stubbs and now await correspondence. It is so nice to think that this paperwork is made as it is the first real step to securing the land.
At 10.00 a.m. on 11th May I again called on Mr Stubbs as I had not received receipt for £150 and was informed that it had not yet been paid in Branch. I asked if deeds could be hurried up and was informed that they would be ready for signature in the near future. On 24th June I had a letter from the Trustee Savings Bank as to why the cheque for £150 drawn on 9th April had not yet been passed through a bank. I later visited Mr Stubbs’ offices and acquainted his secretary of this letter and later sent him the letter and asked if he would reply as I had informed Trustee Savings Bank of circumstances.
On the 14th July I again rang Mr Stubbs and asked if he had the deeds ready. He replied I expect them by the end of the month and as the post is all behind owing to the postal strike that may delay it a little longer.
On the 14th August I again wrote to Mr Stubbs saying that I had not heard from him and asked if he could expedite deeds so that I could tell the Parents Association as they do so much and are anxious.
On the 14th September I called on Mr Hewett and told him that Mr Stubbs had not yet completed the deeds and that I was not to blame for this delay. He quite understood and stated that only last week he had spoken to Mr Stubbs and no doubt I should hear from him soon. He realised that it was not my fault for the delay.
On the 30th September I saw Mr Stubbs in his office and he immediately said “I hope to have the document up to you tomorrow for signature”. Very pleasant news - hope this is true!
On the 8th October I received a letter from Mr Stubbs together with the long awaited document of sale of land at Oakfield Lane for our three signatures
On the 11th instant I wrote to Mr C Stapley and informed him of the good news and asked him to call and sign. On the 17th instant I called on Mr C Stapley and on the 18th I called Mr A Joyce and obtained their signature and on 19th I wrote to Mr Stubbs and deposited with him the document of sale and now hope for the best.
On the 20th instant brought a letter from Mr Stubbs acknowledging receipt of contract sale stating he will let me know when purchase money is required.
As I had not finished the letter I wrote to Mr Stubbs on 30th December 1964 asking him when I am to make the cheque payable and delivered the note personally and was informed by his secretary that he had been ill for some time and was in ward 11A in Joyce Green Hospital. Also all my Stubbs correspondence had been taken over and that in all probability I should be hearing again from them in the near future.
On the 11th January I called on Mr Hewett and asked if he had any news of transfer and he stated that the London solicitors had enquired as to why the transaction had not been completed and that they had sent a notice to Baily and Goff to complete negotiations within a limited number of weeks and that no doubt I should be hearing from the in the next few weeks and asking for the final cash settlement. I trust it will be so.
On the 14th January I called at Messrs. Baily and Goff offices and was informed by his secretary that the contract copy had been posted off to the London solicitors and as soon as it was returned she will communicate with me and give full instruction as to completion of sale of ground.
On 16th January conveyance document arrived by post - what a pleasant surprise. Now for the final signatures and payment. On the 18th January I called at Trustee Savings Bank and had a talk with the Manager and it was decided I call on Friday 22nd instant and draw what was necessary to transfer to Martins Bank vis £962.18s.5d as we now only need to borrow £400 and not originally thought £500. On Friday 22nd January 1964 I duly called at Trustee Savings Bank and drew the sum of £962.18s.5d added £20 cash in hand and went to Martins Bank and paid in £982.18s.5d and drew cheque for £1,362.18s. 5d and with other documents and letters went to Baily and Goff then I was given a receipt on letter and informed that the deeds of the ground would be in my possession in about eight weeks as it gets quite a time for them to be registered etc. All seems well and all persons seem very helpful.
On the 25th January 1965 I call at Kent Education Offices to see Mr Roberts and I was informed that he was engaged and that a letter would be sent to me so that I could see him at a later date but as this did not come I saw Mr Phillips of Y.M.C.A. He stated that he would see Mr Roberts and speak to him about it.
On Sunday 31st January 1965 I visited Mr A Talbot at 42 Birchwood Road, Wilmington and asked him if he could contact Mrs Owen Simmons to whom he sent my application and see if something could be done to hurry up my application. He agreed and asked that I write to him making a lower application as I had only a bank overdraft of £400. Harry and I went to Tom’s (eldest son) and he immediately said do not do anything more at the moment as Mr Phillips has seen Mr Roberts and I can expect correspondence from Kent Education Committee anytime now.
On the 11th February I had a letter from Messrs. Baily and Goff stating that it would be two to three months before the deeds from the Land Commission would be in my hands and that they now require the sum of £1.6s.Id to settle the account.
I immediately sent a letter to A F Taylor and enclosed Baily and Goffs letter so that he could show it to the Bank Manager and I also replied to Baily and Goff and enclosed £1.6s. Id as asked for delivery both by hand.
On 13th February I received a letter and cheque for £16.1 Os.Od from Champion and Waterman being money refunded for period 24th November 1964 to 25th June 1965 when land was purchased for 8th Dartford Scout Troop, very useful.
On the 19th February I paid £50 into Martins Bank leaving now an overdraft of £330. On the 19th March 1 received Declaration of Trust from Law Stationery Society Limited via Messrs. Baily and Goff for our three signatures (another document towards finality) and returned same day signed on 18th March 1965. On the 15th April I again called on Mr Phillips to say that I had heard nothing from Kent Education Committee and he telephoned Mr Talbot and informed him that there was a change at Kent Education Committee. Mr Talbot stated that he would visit and get the forms and then assist me to fill in same. He did not call until 12th April when he stated that Mr Roberts had been moved to another part and that the new man in command at Dartford was very sympathetic to our proposed application; after a talk he said he would call again.
On the 14th May Mr Talbot called with form but as I had not received certain information for the Scoutmaster he said he would again contact Kent Education Committee with a view to us jointly calling with completed form and on 25th May Mr Talbot called and conveyed me to the office. We there met Mrs ???. He appeared to think that we had a very strong case to present and that he thought it best to send our application to Maidstone after he had contacted an official he knew who was on the Board. So far, so good. I must now await the outcome - good or bad.
On the 11th June I received the Deeds of Contract with all the other papers from Messrs. Baily and Goff having been requested by the Law Society. All now is finally passed and settled and the ground belongs to the 8th Dartford Scout Group.
On the 19th June 1965 I received a letter from Kent Education Committee, Gravesend asking if I would meet the Area Youth Officer re my application of 23 rd May in respect of financial aid. 1 replied at once by letter stating I would visit him in his office at Gravesend any time on Monday and I would telephone him to see if it was convenient. I duly telephoned but was informed that he had not been in his office up to 10.00 a.m. I asked that a message be left asking him if he would ring me when he came in but with no good result.
On the 24th June I received another letter from Kent Education Committee, Gravesend and after a telephone message I wrote to Mr Gallagher and he replied by letter that he would call to see me on Friday 16th July at a time suitable to myself and I replied 3.00 p.m. and now await the outcome.
On the 7th July I deposited the Deeds of the ground with A F Taylor esquire as agreed for guarantor for overdraft at Martins Bank.
At 3.20 p.m. on Friday 16th Mr Gallagher visited me and asked various questions regarding application, a very pleasant young man. He stated that he must report to Committee and expected that I should hear what hope.
On 17th February 1965 I received a letter from Kent Education Committee, Gravesend stating that the Committee at Maidstone did not sit until March and my application would then be considered. On 22nd January 1966 I received another letter from Kent Education Committee, Gravesend stating that my application for a grant had been favourably considered and passed to Maidstone and later on the Kent County Council.
On 18th March I received a cheque for £330 from Finance Department, Maidstone re my application for a grant. The Committee must have had great sympathy and kindly feeling towards all our efforts to secure the necessary money and for this wonderful sum I feel very grateful for this is the end of thirty years working and scheming to make the Head Quarters secure for all time and really the Group’s very own.
Now to have a new fence and new flooring so as to fulfil what I stated in my application as being very necessary. I contacted Messrs. Young - fencing contractor - of Orpington who sent a representative to me and we measured up and I later secured an estimate for this work at £71.4s.0d - very reasonable and I wrote and accepted and asked that they put the work in hand as soon as possible. It was erected and completed about 10th July 1966.
Mr Charlie Stapley contacted Hewetsons of Hull in respect to new flooring; it was suggested that 1” x 3” OPE PE was very good hardwearing floors and the price was £83.12s.7d. I made contact with Mr F J Gillham, Builder of Heath Lane, Dartford as also did Mr C Stapley and the floor was laid for the sum of £36.2s.6d - a very good piece of workmanship.
Also an old street lamp was purchased from Dartford Borough Council for £1.1 Os.Od and this was erected overhanging the steps and this is a great help especially on dark nights ( a lamp to lighten our darkness). At the Annual General Meeting held on 2nd May I suggested to all members that it would be nice if we could have a Thanksgiving Service for all our blessings and final success. All agreed and the Reverend Holland said that he would contact the vicar as to a date, time and order of service. The vicar had informed me some time ago when I explained to him that we had paid for all the ground and Head Quarters was our very own, that at a future date he would be pleased to attend.
On the 26th June 1967 Reverend R Griffiths very kindly came and conducted a wonderful Hymn Service. The hymn, prayers and a short talk and for this to me was the final act.
I had written to nearly old members and I am so pleased that nearly all the original ones were present and a prayer was said for all who had helped and passed on. One of the organist for the church played the small organ which made it so nice and all the old members said how much they enjoyed the evening. A cup of tea finished the evening. Over sixty people attended.
By G. H. Hilton